Christian vs. Atheist: Why would a loving God send someone to Hell?

N.B. if you do not wish to read a very long hypothetical conversation between an Atheist and a Christian, please scroll to the 'Analysis' section at the bottom of this blog post, which summarises the major points nicely.

Below is a hypothetical conversation between an Atheist and a Christian. I have tried my best not to create a straw man, including all of the arguments I've heard from Christians and from my own viewpoints when I was one. So here goes, Christian vs. Atheist:

Atheist: Why would a loving God torture his children?
 
Christian: He doesn’t torture us, he wants us to go to Heaven but by being sinful and not repenting our sins we send ourselves to Hell.
 
Atheist: Doesn’t the Bible say that God judges who goes to Heaven and who goes to Hell?
 
Christian: Yes, he judges us, but he cannot let an impure soul into Heaven, he can only exist with perfect souls. Any uncleansed soul must live apart from God and that place is Hell. This means that, in essence, we send ourselves to Hell.
 
Atheist: Why can he not exist with an uncleansed soul?
 
Christian: Because he himself is perfect, so can’t dwell with anything imperfect.
 
Atheist: Why? Are those just the rules of the universe?
 
Christian: Yes.
 
Atheist: And who makes the rules?
 
Christian: God.
 
Atheist: Don’t you see how silly that is then? He could just change the rules. And don’t you think it is an unjust way of judging people?
 
Christian: No, it is God’s perfect justice. If God changed those rules it would be unfair and unjust.
 
Atheist: But according to God’s “perfect justice”, the ones who deserve Heaven are those that believe in him. Isn’t this just selfish, instead of just? And what is just about infinite punishment for finite crimes?
 
Christian: We don’t understand God’s logic because it is much higher than ours. But he loves us and he is perfect in justice so we trust him.
 
Atheist: But if you don’t understand someone’s agenda, why would you believe that they love you and have got it all under control? Couldn’t God actually have a flawed justice system if we don’t understand it? Just because someone tells you they are perfect, it doesn’t mean they are.
 
Christian: God showed his love for us through the sacrifice of his Son, Jesus Christ.
 
Atheist: That doesn’t prove he loves us. He’s still eternally torturing people when they die
 
Christian: Again, he isn’t torturing us, we are choosing to be separate from God by not believing in him.
 
Atheist: But isn’t that a form of hijacking on God’s part? “Believe in me or you will be eternally tortured”. Why couldn’t he create different realms other than Heaven and Hell, places where we would be taught lessons about our wrongs? And also, nobody chooses to go to Hell, if you don’t believe it exists you aren’t choosing to go there!
 
Christian: Again, our brains cannot understand the nature of the afterlife yet. All we know is that God loves us and will judge us.
 
Atheist: But you don’t know that God loves you, because you still can’t explain why he eternally tortures people.
 
Christian: He doesn’t eternally torture people! He wants us to go to heaven, but is perfect in justice so cannot let impure souls into heaven!
 
Atheist: But that “justice” is not justice. First of all, accountability is an issue. Why should a rapist deserve to go to heaven if he repents the rape? Shouldn’t the woman he raped forgive him? Secondly, no finite crime deserves infinite punishment. Third, why does Joseph Stalin deserve the same punishment as a 10 year old African kid that’s never heard of God?
 
Christian: Again, we do not understand this justice system. But God is perfect, so he makes the right decisions.
 
Atheist: You assert this, but how can you back it up?
 
Christian: Because God said it himself in the Bible!
 
Atheist: And how do you know he’s telling the truth?
 
Christian: Because he’s God, he can’t lie!
 
Atheist: How do you know?
 
Christian: Because he’s God! And he said it himself!

               

Atheist: Didn’t God also kill children and order the death of witches and tell a tribe to kill and rape other tribes and promote slavery and tell everyone he likes the smell of burning carcass and that he’s jealous and hates gays? Why would you trust a God like that?
 
Christian: Because I know he’s perfect, after all he sent Jesus down to Earth to be sacrificed. His own Son! For our sins.
 
Atheist: So, he made up a rule that everyone deserves to be eternally tortured unless they are cleansed of their sins, and then “saved” everyone from his own rule by killing his son? Do you not see how stupid that is?
 
Christian: No. Humans are sinners by nature, ever since the original sin. We are not perfect and therefore do not deserve to dwell with God, who is perfect. But God made a way for us to, by giving us redemption through Christ.
 
Atheist: Yeah, so he’s saving us from his own elitist rules! Brilliant. And also, that still isn’t fair. The billions of people before, during and after the time of Jesus, who didn’t even know he existed, they all had to go to Hell without even a chance of salvation. But the people that have heard about him and believe it can go to heaven? It’s not justice, or equality for that matter, at all! 

Christian: God takes each soul's judgement into account and is always fair.

Atheist: But according to your logic, everyone deserves to go to Hell, and the only way to heaven is believing in Jesus Christ.

Christian: Well I'm sure God manifests in them or something else that we can't yet comprehend, and gives them the chance to redeem themselves

Atheist: Well that's rather more speculative than supported. Let me ask you a question. Do you think I deserve to be eternally tortured?

Christian: No.
 
Atheist: So aren’t you more loving than God?
 
Christian: No, I am less just than God. He can’t just let a bunch of people who have sinned into Heaven, because where do you draw the line? It would be unjust.
 
Atheist: So you’re saying that it’s justice if I am eternally tortured?
 
Christian: Well… yes, if you don’t repent your sins.
 
Atheist: So you do think I deserve eternal torture.
 
Christian: No, I didn’t say that, I said that it would be unjust for God to let sinners into Heaven.
 
Atheist: But isn’t it even more unjust for God to punish rapists and murderers in equal measure to law-abiding, loving, caring atheists? And isn't it more unjust to punish someone forever?
 
Christian: We don’t understand the afterlife yet. We don’t even know if Hell is like physical torture or just separation from God’s goodness.
 
Atheist: So if you don’t understand it, you can’t say it’s just.
 
Christian: Yes I can, because God is just, I know he is.
 
Atheist: No you don’t know he is because you still cannot explain why he tortures people.
 
Christian: Yes I can and already have! He cannot let people into Heaven if they are impure. It would be an injustice.
 
Atheist: And I say it again, where is the justice in infinite punishment for finite crimes?
 
Christian: If you choose not to believe in God, you are choosing to go to Hell. You are the only one to blame.
 
Atheist: You really think I’d choose to go to Hell? I don’t believe in God. I don’t choose not to believe in God, I can not believe in him, my intelligence doesn’t allow me to. I would only be choosing Hell if I believed it existed.
 

Christian: Yes but if a man holds a knife up against your neck and asks you to give him money, he’s still going to hurt you even if you think it’s all a dream or something and don’t believe it’s happening.

Atheist: And that’s what it’s like, God is holding a knife against our neck. It's robbery! But it’s so unconvincing (i.e. he expects us to believe in him on a self-contradictory, Stone Age book with no evidence or original copies) that it is like an invisible man is holding a knife against our neck.
 
Christian: Come on, you know God is true but you reject him.
 
Atheist: No, actually I know your god isn’t true.
 
Christian: You’re just saying that but deep down you know the world makes more sense with a God at the center.
 
Atheist: I'm afraid you're wrong about my opinions there. But anyway, a loving God would not expect us to rely on such awful testimony as the Bible. The creator of human intelligence would understand atheist criticisms and try to appeal to us in a much more obvious and sensible way. A loving God would also not torture anyone for eternity. He would teach us lessons and punish evil, but not forever. He would give us much more opportunity and reason to believe in him. In fact, he wouldn’t even require our belief in him, he would judge us based on our actions. Do you not see that this God you worship has got it all wrong. That he is pathetic and evil?

Christian: NO, our God loves us more than we can possibly imagine, and we should love him for all the wonderful things he’s given us, I mean just look at the Earth!
 

Atheist: Again, you have no reason to believe that God loves us, apart from the fact that he’s told us he loves us, which could be a complete lie. And also, if we should love God for his generosity in our lives, should the people who are suffering horribly in the world hate God for all the horrible things he’s given them? You are a thinking person and you shouldn’t be worshipping at the invisible feet of the world’s worst mass murderer and torturer.
 
Christian: He is not any of those things, he created man with free will and with that free will we created sin and all the horrible things in the world. God is loving because he has given us redemption through Jesus Christ; he didn’t even have to do that.
 
Atheist: Don’t Christians claim that God is omniscient? I.e. he knows everything that has happened and everything that will happen? So when he placed the forbidden fruit tree in the garden of Eden, he knew that Adam and Eve would eat from it. So he knew the world would get into a state, and that people would be tortured for the rest of eternity. That means that he could have stopped it, he didn’t have to cause all of this suffering because he knew it would happen. If God is all powerful he is accountable for all evil and suffering in the world. He is 100% accountable, and his creations, us, who are far inferior in wisdom and power, have no accountability for it.
 
Christian: God gave Adam and Eve everything, yet they disobeyed him. So God cursed every future generation with a sinful nature.
 
Atheist: Oh, so God really did cause all the evil and suffering then! Also, that shows he’s unfair, because he created Adam and Eve to be perfect, but not me or you, which means he treated them better than us! Injustice.
 
Christian: You’re just saying silly things now.
 
Atheist: No, you’re making bad points, and haven’t reasoned well against any of mine. All I can conclude is that you are brainwashed in your belief, and that your emotional and biased links with your religion force you to make unreasonable arguments in favour of it. You may not see this now but I hope you do in the future, like I did when I became an Atheist.

Analysis

What we learn from this kind of conversation with a Christian:

• Christian logic (oxymoron) is that God does not send anyone to Hell, it is us that deny belief in him, reject his offer of forgiveness, and therefore send ourselves to Hell. 
• Everyone is a sinner by nature, therefore nobody is a pure soul.
• Only pure souls can exist in God's realm, because God himself is pure. Allowing an impure soul into heaven would be unjust. Every sin must have justice dealt to it.
• However, Jesus offers forgiveness through his sacrifice, allowing our souls to be cleansed and fit for heaven. 

 

The problem with this:

1) By the Christian's logic, Jesus' forgiveness is an unjust, unfair act of God. It allows those who, according to the Christian, deserve punishment for all their sins, to be wiped of this sentence just by believing something. God's forgiveness through Jesus Christ, essentially punishes non-belief, which for many thinking people is impossible to escape from.

2) This is even more unfair because billions of people in the present day and throughout history have not even heard of Jesus' forgiveness. When probed about this, Christians will say that "God takes each case into account, and is just in his judgement." However, if it is true that an 'impure soul' cannot go to Heaven, and if it is also true that everyone is by nature an impure soul, it must be true that everybody who hasn't heard of Jesus goes to Hell. God has offered forgiveness to some and not others, which is unjust.

3) God created the terms and conditions of divine judgement, which means we do not "send ourselves to Hell", God does. A useful metaphor for this stems from one of the Christian's own points (the knife against neck metaphor):  


A man holds a gun to your head and says give me £100. If you don't give him £100, you are rejecting his wonderful offer of forgiveness. You are committing suicide. You are sending yourself to an early grave.
Does this make any sense? No! It's not a wonderful offer of forgiveness, it's robbery, and if he killed you it would be murder, not suicide. God's judgement is robbery in the same way.

Also, atheists, agnostics and people of other faiths than Christianity are not "sending themselves to Hell", because they don't even believe that God exists.

What's worse is that the case God makes for his actual existence is too poor to be believed by a thinking person. It's like the same robbery metaphor, except the man with the gun is invisible, and a few crazy people are shouting contradictory things to you about how loving this invisible armed robber is and how forgiving he's been with the whole £100 thing.

4) If it is unjust for impure souls to exist in a pure realm, it is also unjust for anyone that isn't 100% evil and barbaric to go to a place of 100% evil. Every sin being punished is a fair enough point, but eternal torture is not an amount of punishment that equates to the amount of sin being commited. Once all sins are punished, surely the soul is clean and can go to heaven? Isn't that how it should work? Why do Christians say that God is "just" when he dishes out infinite punishment for finite crimes?

 

"God works in mysterious ways"

 

The text highlighted yellow demonstrates the Christian's fallback unfalsifiable counter argument that he resorts to when logic overcomes him. In the debate, he tries to explain God's judgement, but when faced with a good argument from the atheist, that shows God's judgement does not add up, the Christian reverts back to the good old "God works in mysterious ways" copout. Phrases such as "God's logic is higher than ours" and "We do not understand God's ways", are all copout philosophies that were implemented into the religion in order to retain followers. The problem with this unfalsifiablility-booster is this: if the Christian does not understand why God tortures people, he shouldn't worship and love him. This is a recurring theme throughout my blog.

Conclusion 

 

Christians are taught, before anything else, that God loves them, and is kind and generous and forgiving. This is, more often than not, drilled into children's heads in childhood, before they learn about Hell and the old testament. 

 

This belief about God's goodness is so strong by the time the Christian learns about the bad stuff, that he makes everything 'fit in' with his beliefs about God's love and perfection. He makes excuses for God's terrible deeds, unfair judgement, and wicked nature. 



If something conflicts what we believe we know is true, we will do mental backflips to overcome that conflict. So although Hell completely contradicts what is taught about God's loving nature and omnipotence, it must be justice because God is just and that's what the Christian knows (i.e has been brainwashed into believing) to be true.

This is why it is so hard to have a logical debate with a Christian. If they cannot reason against opposing arguments, they either resort to the "God works in mysterious ways" line, or become angry and assertive. This is a telltale sign of someone who has been brainwashed. 

I think it's time to stop brainwashing our kids into believing and defending with passion a set of teachings that 1) we cannot logically support and 2) tells them they deserve to be eternally tortured.

Thanks for reading. 
Dave

What goes on in a Christian's head?

Being an ex-Christian is a real psychological eye-opener. Looking back at the way I thought and felt as a Christian gives me insight not only into my own mind but into the collective minds of Christians alike. Being a studied atheist gives you the ability to reason against Christianity, but being an ex-Christian as well allows you to understand the reasoning behind the opposing arguments.

Being only 18 when I became an atheist means that I can't speak confidently about how an older Christian feels and thinks about religion, but having been a very devoted and passionate believer I feel I can recognise most of the arguments and emotions of any Christian empathetically.

So, what is it that makes a Christian believe? What is it that triggers deep love for an invisible being, that conjures up the passionate arguments against atheists, and that is willing to defend even the most disgusting of God's crimes against humanity? Let me outline the major psychological explanations that come from both my general knowledge and personal experience of religion.

1) Guilt

Guilt is a heavily influencing factor of a Christian's belief in and love for God. When we are faced with guilt that can't be resolved, an action that can't be taken back, we don't know what to do with ourselves, and sometimes it can feel absolutely awful. The escape for the Christian lies in the realm of the supernatural. One of Christianity's central teachings is that God is forgiving and will forgive whoever repents, and therefore the Christian can load at least part of their guilt onto God if nothing can be done to resolve their guilty conscience.

When I was a Christian, offloading my guilt via repentance was often a big relief, almost like a 'supernatural painkiller'. The reality of this instilled in me a more real sense that there was a God that acted in response to prayer.

What I did find though was that rather than diminishing my guilt, Christianity increased the amount of things I felt guilty about. After all, the Bible teaches that we all deserve eternal torture by default. This sort of teaching made me feel bad for every wrong thing I did, which at times made me genuinely unhappy and lowered my self esteem. However, even though I realised that believing in God was the cause of this, I never considered it a bad thing - I considered it as enlightenment, the beginning of the process of me becoming a better person.

2) Our desire for companionship

It's normal for humans to seek out companionship and love. We need social success to thrive and feel confident and happy, and when we find a mutual sense of affection or love with somebody, it gives us those things. The idea that God (or more popularly cited in the subject of personal relationships, Jesus) is always with him and loves him provides the Christian with an easy accessible fountain of comfort and contentment. The Christian always has a friend to talk to, someone there when he is lonely.

What is even more intriguing about the relationship Christians have with Jesus is this: because Jesus is actually just a figment of the Christian's own imagination, the Christian can create a Jesus that really loves him. He can feel a sense of overwhelming love for the person that he is, overwhelming knowledge of his past and present and feelings and doubts and worries and everything they are about - because Jesus is, well, Jesus is the Christian himself. If the Christian loves himself, then the Jesus his mind has created will love him too.

(apologies for the poor wording of that paragraph - it was difficult to explain)

This sense of connection and understanding further deepens the reality of God in the Christian's mind.

3) Inferiority/Superiority complex 

One of the keys to understanding how a Christian's mind works is the inferiority/superiority complex.

An inferiority complex is a feeling of worthlessness or lower status. The world is so beautiful, space is so vast, and life so incredibly complex that naturally our minds seek a creator. For the Christian, God is the creator, and the genuine belief in that god paves the way to a feeling of inferiority, to the point of feeling unworthy of anything good. Personally I felt very unworthy of good things that happened to me when I was a Christian.

A nasty element of Christianity is that it also has the ability to give its believers a superiority complex, which means the Christian thinks he is better than non-Christians. This is part of the religion I certainly don't miss, and that causes me some embarassment when I think back to that time. A Christian with non-Christian friends and family will begin to feel like he is the only good person he knows outside of church. This superiority is another "social success" in a way. Not only does it make the Christian feel better about himself, but it will strengthen his relationship with the church, because he naturally seeks out and spends time with people he relates to. This stronger bond with other Christians will positively reinforce his religious belief, strengthening it even more. 'Positive reinforcement' brings me onto my next point:

4) Positive reinforcement from other Christians

I was lucky enough not to have been brought up in a particularly Christian family, and therefore was not brainwashed as so many children are. But part of my belief in Christianity stemmed from the constant positive reinforcement of it by members of my church. Churches these days, at least in my experience, are increasingly bouncy, happy, loving, kind, encouraging places. And in a sea of doubts, worries, daily routine, boredom or sadness, a church can often be a place of relief and sanctuary for its regulars. Personally, my church's vibe and attitude was a real refresher in my week. It was a place where people talked non-stop about love, and compassion, and care, and charity, and everything that is good about human nature. Much different from the bullying and immaturity of school.


This light in the dark one day a week (or however many times one might go to church) subconsciously (or even consciously) suggests to the Christian that God is indeed "the Way, the Truth and the Life". Though God has not actually showed himself or played any part personally in the service, his name being constantly at the center of discussion forms a mental link between church and God, and therefore between goodness and God.

When it comes to children brought up in a majority Christian environment, brainwashing is the only term I will use, and I won't apologise for using it. It's true that we, in a sense, 'brainwash' our children in many areas of life, such as telling them that stealing things is wrong, and that helping others is good. Positive reinforcement of good things, and negative reinforcement of bad things (like giving a child a chocolate bar for helping with the household chores, or telling off a child for hitting their brother or sister), determines a child's behaviour and sense of morality in later life. Similarly, teaching a child something is good and true will implant in their head that it is true. Children in strong Christian families face constant exposure to the Bible and its teachings - at church, at home, often at school, and often from a very young age. Children are so impressionable that in later life it is very difficult to persuade them that their religion isn't true. As we will see in point 5, even when faced with extremely compelling arguments the Christian will resort to "faith", which is a synonym for their brainwashed mind.

This explains why there are so many Christians in the world - it may sound mean of me to word it like this, but religion is like a genetic disease passed down through families via brainwashing.

5) The unfalsifiable nature of Christianity

The previous 4 points have developed a strong emotional bond between the Christian and his figmented 'God'. This emotional connection means that when faced with compelling arguments against their beliefs, the Christian will panic, become angry, upset, and very defensive.

The Christian's escape from this panic is the unfalsifiable nature of Biblical teachings. What does this mean? It means that there is always something a Christian can say in defence of their religion, because the Bible has a quote or teaching for every doubt or reasoning against its position. Let me give some examples of what an Atheist might say to a Christian, and how the unfalsifiable nature of the Bible allows the Christian to respond:


Atheist: Why is the world so beautiful?
Christian: Because God is designed it that way. (Romans 1:20)

Atheist: But if he is such a good designer why do cancer, and natural disasters, and poverty exist?
Christian: Because Adam and Eve ate from the tree and God cursed humanity. (Genesis 3)

Atheist: You have a nice house, job and family.
Christian: Yes, God has really blessed me.
Atheist: But you're paralysed from the waist down, is that a blessing?
Christian: God is testing my faith. (James 1:3)

Atheist: What would you do if you found out the Bible was just made up stories?
Christian: I would still believe because the Holy Spirit has revealed itself to me. (John 14:26)

Atheist: Why does God allow so many innocent people to suffer terribly and die without even hearing about the Bible?
Christian: God works in mysterious ways. (1 Corinthians 2:7)

Atheist: Why doesn't God appear to us all in broad daylight so that we believe in him?
Christian: Because it would be violating our free will - God can do anything apart from affect free will. Also, he wants us to believe in him out of choice.
Atheist: So why did he appear to people in the Bible?
Christian: So that he could reveal his perfect word to humanity.

 

 At least Jackie Chan understands my outrage at this logic

Atheist: Is God loving?

Christian: Yes, He is love, He loves us more than we could imagine.

Atheist: Then why does God only allow a place of eternal bliss and a place of eternal torture to exist? Could he not have thought of anything less harsh and more... constructive?

Christian: We do not understand God's ways and logic.

Thanks again Jackie

Atheist: There is no evidence for God.
Christian: Yes there is, Jesus performed many miracles to demonstrate that he was the Son of God.
Atheist: Actually, when you think about it, Jesus' miracles prove jack shit about God.
Christian: Well we don't need evidence because we have faith.
                                                                                        ^ COP-OUT

Atheist: *well assembled, reasonable, intelligent argument against Christianity*
Christian: God's wisdom is higher than yours. (1 Corinthians 1:25)
                                  

The Christian always has an escape, and you simply can't argue with the things they say. Their religion is unfalsifiable. For a Christian, this is satisfying. However, even if there was an argument that couldn't be reasoned against, I know from personal experience that the Christian would ignore it, because their emotional and 'spiritual' connection with God (as described in the first 4 points) is enough to trump all logic and reason. Luckily enough for me, my emotional bond wasn't as strong, because I only started to believe at 13 - although, the process of becoming an atheist was still a very upsetting and emotionally confusing time.

Summary

The Christian mind is attacked by the various deceits and mind-trickeries of Christian teaching. The Christian is offered a scapegoat for his guilt, and a loving friend in times of need - who is also vastly superior (it's like if your favourite celebrity loved you - you would feel amazing! 'God's' love is like emotional porn).The Christian is trained to feel better than others, yet small and unworthy compared to God. The Christian is positively reinforced by his Christian peers, and often brainwashed from childhood. And because these emotional links to the religion are so hard to break that even convincing arguments against it are tossed aside, the Christian - the world's Christians - have no reason to stop believing in God. I'm proud that I managed to escape the claws of the disease ridden rat that is religion. But sad that so many are taken in by it, and that so many minds are closed off. I understand why Christians say what they do, why they get so worked up when a good atheistic argument is put across, and why they close off their minds, because I was the same not so long ago. But knowing those things, I also know that it is a massive task to try to convince a Christian that his/her beliefs are untrue, and this reduces my hope that, one day, reason will take over emotion, and society will be free of religious nonsense (please note, I don't favour genocide or the abolition of religion - I favour free thought!). But there is still hope. Atheism is growing year on year. More people are "coming out of the closet" of atheism. The world is slowly realising that it is better to trust science - the collective knowledge of mankind, than the grumblings of a jealous, murderous, spontaneous, selfish, childish, angry, bloodthirsty Iron Age god of the illiterate middle east.

Thanks for reading.

Ex-Christian vs. God

I still haven't quite reached the point of trying to prove (or, let's say, demonstrate) that God/gods don't exist, because I've still got a lot to say about what I think of the Christian god if he IS true. In previous posts I have shown why god is unfair and shouldn't be trusted, and now I want to show why I'm kinder, more generous, more sensible, and overall more morally respectable than god (wow, my arrogance will NOT win me a place in heaven if he is true!).

Let's do this like a game. We'll take each moral issue as it comes and reward a point to the one who has the morally superior outlook on it. Here goes, an ex-Christian vs. God:

 

A) Make a list of your top 10 moral concerns, in a "don't do x" format:

Ex-Christian:
"Hmm, okay, tough one, well how about these:
1) Don't kill anyone (murder)
2) Don't attack anyone (physical abuse)
3) Don't take anything that doesn't belong to you without permission (theft)
4) Don't claim ownership of anyone (slavery)
5) Don't abuse the natural world out of greed (environmental damage)
6) Don't discriminate against someone because of their race, sexuality or gender (prejudice)
7) Don't harm a child, physically or mentally (child abuse)
8) Don't cheat on your partner or spouse (adultery)
9) Don't blackmail or exploit anyone (exploitation)
10) Don't bully anyone (abuse)
It's a rough draft, but I think I've included the majority of moral concerns here."

God:
"I actually already have a list, which you can find in Exodus 20:3-17 of my book, the |Holy Bible|; here it is:
1) Kiss my arse, nobody else's
2) Don't draw pictures of me or anything else and pray to them, because I'm jealous and if you do it I'll kick not only your arse but your children and your children's children and your children's children's children's arses too.
3) Don't use my name in a bad way, only in a kiss-assy kind of way, or I'll kick your arse.
4) Don't you fucking dare work on a sunday, because I DIDN'T when I created the earth, so it's MY DAY and you can't do any work on it, and neither can any of your servants or animals or women or children or anything!
5) Treat your parents well, or else I'll kick you out of where you live.
6) Don't kill anyone.
7) Don't cheat on your spouse.
8) Don't steal anything.
9) Don't give false testimony against your neighbour.
10) Don't want anything that doesn't belong to you. Don't fancy some guy's wife, or want his servants, or his pets, or anything that belongs to him.

VERDICT:
Well, it seems the ex-Christian has a good set of moral values there. God on the other hand... sounds like a spoilt brat. Almost half of his moral concerns are all about kissing his arse, and a lot of them contain threats. God himself is sexist within his commandments, which are very much directed at men (do not covet your neighbour's wife???), and generally he comes across as a massive douchebag. There are a few good commandments, but not really any that the ex-Christian didn't include. Gotta hand the point to the ex-Christian here.

Ex-Christian 1 - 0 God

B) What should happen to someone if they break any of these 10 rules?

Ex-Christian:

"Well, a lot of those have various laws surrounding them already, for example a life-sentence in prison for a murderer, and shorter prison sentences for abuse, theft etc. Some don't really require punishment, they are just good morals to live by. For example, cheating on your partner, it's not a good thing to do, but it's all private stuff really and it's not something that should be punished by the government."

God:
"Breaking any of my commandments is punishable by merciless torture until the end of time (Revelation 21:8 2, Thessalonians 1:9). Everyone that has ever lived has broken one (Romans 3:23), so everyone deserves eternal torture and I will make sure that happens. I can't live with anyone who isn't perfect according to my standards (Revelation 21:22-27), so they can burn for all I care. However, about 2000 years ago I tortured and killed my son, who hadn't broken any of these laws, so that means that anyone who believes in him and repents their sins can be forgiven and can live with me (John 3:16).

VERDICT:
Errrm, okay God. You tortured and killed your son, which means that anyone who believes that he is your son and asks forgiveness can live with you in heaven... but anyone who doesn't believe in him can burn for eternity? How very fair of you...
Well done ex-Christian, there is a lot of injustice in the world but a thorough, non-biased and well-regulated criminal justice system is an excellent way to reduce this.

Ex-Christian 2 - 0 God

C) What is your opinion on slavery?

Ex-Christian:
"I think it's an abomination, and I'm sad that it still exists in the world. People should never be used as property, everyone should have the freedom to make their own way in the world and decide things for themselves. It is also rare that slaves are treated well, and countless times in history and even in the present, slaves have been beaten, malnourished and neglected. Nobody should be owned, never mind worked to death!"

God:
"I don't really appreciate some of the slavery that's gone on, but I'm pretty crazy about controlled slavery. I made a bunch of rules about it, for example I told my people the Israelites that they weren't allowed to enslave each other but that it was perfectly fine to take slaves from other countries and clans (Leviticus 25:44-46)."

VERDICT:
The ex-Christian understands how slavery creates inequality and destroys the individuality and basic human rights of its victims. God, on the other hand, seems to have been pretty keen on it in the past, and hasn't really given any indication to humanity about whether he still likes it or not.


Gotta give the point to the ex-Christian here, for both integrity and moral superiority.

Ex-Christian 3 - 0 God

D) Who do you love, and how do you show it?

Ex-Christian:
"Love is a difficult word to define, but I would certainly say I love my close family and friends. I show them I love them by spending time with them and being there for them in difficult situations. One day I hope to feel a different, stronger kind of love, for a woman. We may decide we want to marry each other to express our love, and even have children, which we will both love unconditionally, so much so that we will ensure they are safe, happy and fulfilled until we die. I have a certain kind of love for my fellow man, the kind that will help a stranger in trouble, and give to worthwile charities. However, I can't say that I care about everyone, because I don't really think about anyone that I don't spend time with."

God:
"I love everyone in the entire world, unconditionally and unbeatably. There is nobody in the whole world that loves each person more than I do. I am love. (1 John 4:7-8) I have shown them this love through my word in my best-selling book, the Bible, and through creating them and giving them the incredible planet Earth to live on. I have also shown them my love through the sacrifice of my beloved son, Jesus. If they love me in return, and believe in my son and repent their sins, I will grant them everlasting life and happiness by my side. If they don't love me back though, they'll burn forever." (John 3:16)

VERDICT:

Wow, it was going quite well for God until that last sentence. The ex-Christian has a pretty normal idea of love, and admits that the word love has an array of meanings and that he can't love everyone. God however, claims to love everyone more than any human can, yet will burn you for eternity if the feeling isn't mutual. Sorry god, but I don't think that's love at all...

Ex-Christian, you've done it again. 1 moral superiority point goes to you! God still on zero.

Ex-Christian 4 - 0 God

E) What do you think about witches?

Ex-Christian:
"Errm, well I don't think magic and sorcery really exist, so to be honest I think people that practice that kind of thing are a bit weird. Each to their own though."

God:
"You shall not permit a sorceress to live! (Exodus 22:18). That's right, anyone that practices any kind of magic, other than miracle working in my name, should be killed! Derren Brown! Why has nobody killed him yet?! I thought I had millions of followers. Clearly they've all forgotten about that commandment!

VERDICT:
Yep, there we go, God happily contradicting himself as usual. Ordering people to break his own commandments, and all out of jealousy! Ask any christian though and they'll tell you that god doesn't think that any more. It's quite strange that he changed his opinions, especially after saying "For I am the Lord, I do not change” (Malachi 3:6). Maybe he was talking about his underwear, we'll never know.
The ex-Christian has his opinions of witches, which is fine (haha, 'witches-which is'). He isn't ordering anyone to burn them to death. Good. He gets the point again.

Ex-Christian 5 - 0 God 

F) Final question, who deserves harsher punishment, a man who earnestly facilitates the horrendously painful deaths of millions of people simply because of their religious beliefs, or a 2 year old un-baptised child that doesn't know anything about god.

Ex-Christian:
"Well I assume you're talking about Adolf Hitler and the Holocaust. This is a pretty strange question, obviously Hitler deserved extremely harsh punishment, but why would you punish a 2 year old at all?

God:

"Hitler eh? He was a very bad man and he's burning in Hell now. I mean, if he'd repented his sins at the end of his life, I would have let him have eternal bliss, no questions asked. He was a believer after all. But that 2 year old? Disgraceful! There is no worse sin than not believing in me and my son! (no bible quote for this but http://www.christiananswers.net/q-grace/hell-and-god.html certainly seems to think so). I'll burn that little son of a bitch for all eternity, just like I am doing to Hitler! They both deserve eternal and merciless torture, in equal measure."

VERDICT:
Here we see the embarassing evils of Christianity, which at its core teaches that killing masses of people is no worse than not believing in Jesus. The ex-Christian undoubtedly wins the moral point for this.

Ex-Christian 6 - 0 God  

FINAL RESULT

The winner, by a 6-0 whitewash, is the ex-Christian! Commiserations to the Creator of the universe, you just aren't as morally intact as the ex-Christian, or most human beings for that matter.

Thanks for reading.